Photos used by a different real estate agent

General Discussions
#10

As a broker we always ask the photographer if someone requests to use the photos. If its another agent they will be likely asked to pay a nominal license fee.
if its a homeowner they will be asked to attribute the photographer to any posts.

it is not cool for an agent to let another agent use the photos unless the photographer is consulted.

I dont even know what my photographers contract says. I just feels its the right thing to do.

I would remind the agent that photos are not transferable without written authorization from the photographer and if you dont have it in your agent agreement I would add it .

BTW the only reason I do my own iGuide is because there are no photographers locally who offer anything but matter port which I find cheesy and not social media marketing friendly. I always use professionals to shoot photos and video in addition to my iGuide.

Marshall

2 Likes
#11

Hi Kathy, my wife is a Realtor and she told me that agents reusing other agents images is against the Realtor Ethics Code (NAR). I took a quick look and this is what I found which I believe is the appropriate section:-

  • Standard of Practice 12-10

REALTORS®’ obligation to present a true picture in their advertising and representations to the public includes Internet content, images, and the URLs and domain names they use, and prohibits REALTORS® from:

  1. engaging in deceptive or unauthorized framing of real estate brokerage websites;
  2. manipulating (e.g., presenting content developed by others) listing and other content in any way that produces a deceptive or misleading result;
  3. deceptively using metatags, keywords or other devices/methods to direct, drive, or divert Internet traffic; or
  4. presenting content developed by others without either attribution or without permission, or
  5. otherwise misleading consumers, including use of misleading images. (Adopted 1/07, Amended 1/18)
1 Like
#12

I explain the rights issues - they are almost always unaware of this and see it as a negative.

What are the rights with Matterport? I’d like to know that in case it comes up with clients.

I hype the benefits of incorporating Lidar into the capture process to guarantee accuracy of measurements, floor plans etc - they are usually always pleasantly surprised by this as well.

Is Matterport not Lidar-based? They don’t rely on photogrammetry, do they?

Thanks for the elaboration.

#13

I’m not surprised but I’m glad that it’s spelled out like that.

#14

When I was researching camera systems there was of course a bunch of info around Matterport which seemed to have a strong foot hold already. As I dug deeper and read the user agreement, it clearly spells out that Matterport owns all rights to the content they created from your images.

No Lidar on a Matterport. They use a point cloud system which is not nearly as accurate.

1 Like
#15

Good to know all this. Thank you.

#16

I thought that point cloud was lidar? My belief was that Matterport used photogrammetry.

#17

Standard Matterport (their $4K version is photogrammetry) they also offer a camera from Leica which is LIDAR at $18,000!

#18

How did you find out that your photos were used outside your initial sale to the purchasing agent?

#19

My photos were posted on Facebook by an agent I did not do business with!! I found out later that the agent I shot them for gave the second agent permission to use them.

#20

Stand up for your professional rights. Sounds like you have just cause for legal action. I may suggest including something like, “Clients are paying for a Photography Service and are purchasing a “License to Use” the photographs, exclusive for the Marketing for Sale of a specific real estate property,
online and basic print media use.
*Images may NOT be shared or re-sold, to any other party or person including the homeowner. Infraction subject to the Canadian Copyright Act.” in all your shoot agreements.

#21

Would this be weird to put in a pop up after someone books online. I figure it would be a constant reminder to every agent. I am considering doing this myself.

#22

I suggest listening to https://shootingspacespodcast.com/podcast/episode-123-ask-the-guys-47-new-agent-using-your-photos-without-the-proper-license/ for a discussion about scenarios like this.

I would hesitate to clobber agents with anything that comes across as heavy handed (like a pop up). I think a better approach to is detail your terms and conditions and have your booking form either require a checkbox acknowledging the T&Cs or a statement along the lines of “submitting a booking indicates acceptance of yours T&Cs”.

#23

My two cents is that it’s just a losing battle to prosecute an agent for something this minor and it’s a missed opportunity to bring them into your fold.

We have had several issues with agents just grabbing our stuff offline, including custom videos that were made for other agents. But, to be honest, it’s not really worth our time to chase them. We make more money by going forward, not back.

Bottom line is that people have zero understanding of intellectual property and the rights of the image creator. In their mind they are buying a product that they can use for whatever they want. If you put in a simple copyright disclaimer you can at least claim moral high ground when they do steal from you and it’s something you can refer them to at least as a tsk tsk.

Something to be mindful of is that agents can be mercurial and vindictive when they don’t get their way and you’ll just exacerbate their ire by threatening them with small claims. Might be better to turn it into a sales opportunity vs having them pan you on social to their friends.

Just a thought. Hope it helps.

#24

Greetings All,

I thought I would toss in my 2-cents. I have been a Realtor® for 17-years and started my photography business by accident 7-years ago when I couldn’t find anyone providing the imagery and content I was looking for. The first year I was very lenient and forgiving and sent invoices out the day of the shoot and delivered the content and thought everyone would pay immediately as though they were at a grocery store, restaurant or another business that you pay for what you had just received. Was I wrong! It got as much as $10k owed and I spent hours being polite and nice asking for payment. Some it went as far as getting Brokers involved. I started a media business NOT a bill collection business. January 1 of the second year I changed all that. I added the following “Terms” (below) to the confirmation email I send clients once I confirm their appointment. The same “Terms” are on my website as well as the very last step before a client hits submit when ordering AND at the bottom of the invoice I send out the morning of the photoshoot. NO content is delivered until payment is received. I have had maybe less than a handful of people say anything about it. I may have even lost some clients to competition because of it, but I believe that those clients weren’t ones that really wanted to do business with me and I am okay with that. I don’t want all of the business, only the right business. The last two things I will add that I saw in this or another post; If another agent wants to use images from a listing that has “expired/withdrawn” I charge the same rate as I did the first agent, no exceptions. Why should the second agent get a discount that the first agent did not. I firmly believe that my images (along with price) is going to get the property sold so why would I diminish the value of my work. Lastly, I remind the agents that they CANNOT give away the images even to the Seller, however, I will send the Seller the images of their home for memento use only after close of escrow at NO COST. It is my gift to them. I hope this may help some of you.

By ordering services from ToddsFotos.com you agree to the following Service Agreement for Digital Imagery and Tour Products. These terms are subject to change without notice.

TEMPORARY USAGE/LICENSING RIGHTS: FOR SALE OR LEASE PROPERTIES:

Here at ToddsFotos.com, we grant you Temporary Usage/Licensing Rights of the images you purchase for a greatly reduced rate under our Realtor Scale. You get to enjoy our superb photography for unlimited print and web use in marketing your listing and when the listing is sold and/or you are no longer the listing agent, the image rights are withdrawn with the exception of use in Just Sold / Listing Presentations / Personal Marketing materials.

All of our images are copyrighted and are the intellectual property of ToddsFotos.com. We license our images to you for temporary use but the ownership of the images remains with ToddsFotos.com.

The images you purchase are non-transferable and cannot be given away, bartered or sold.

The client who pays for the images is the only one who has the rights to use the images. You cannot give those images to the homeowner, builder, designer, remodeler, stager, etc. of the property photographed nor can you resell the images to anyone or split payment with anyone so they can use the images.

DELIVERY OF IMAGES AND/OR TOUR:

An invoice will be sent via email the day of and prior to the photo shoot. Payment can be paid securely online with a debit/credit card. You may also bring/leave a check at the property at the time of the shoot. Completed photos/tour will be delivered to you once invoice has been paid.

1 Like
#25

I fully agree with your approach. Most people are not aware of copyright law. Sometimes a friendly conversation with them can turn them into clients (or licensing revenue). I generated tidy revenue last year by licensing photos to people or organizations that used my work without permission, but willingly licensed many more images after a phone call.

In cases were you’re talking to undesirables with zero good will, you wouldn’t want to deal with them daily anyway. Sometimes it’s better to make your point and walk away than get aggressive.

My approach is carrot over stick, and think of the long game.

1 Like
#26

That’s right to the point. Can I use that, or do I have to pay you a license fee? I wouldn’t even have to change the name!

Todd Wasylyshyn
Nananimo Photography

#27

Thanks for your input everyone.

I was second guessing myself on how to handle it. I agree that agents do not understand the concept of the copyright laws when dealing with photography or video. They believe that the iGuide package provides ownership of the photos and that they have paid for it when it’s basically just a courtesy to them. The time and effort do not equal what they have paid for. Agents are fickle creatures and everyone is always out to save a dollar or get value for that dollar. We all need to continue to educate and remind our clients on our own value proposition just as agents do when they are doing their listing or buyer presentations.

#28

Todd (not me, but the other one),
Nice to see that there is a sense of humor on here. I don’t have a problem with anybody using what I posted. Just make sure to change the name to protect the innocent…

#29

Perhaps I should be like Kevin O’Leary on shark Tank. I could charge you a royalty fee in perpetuity…